MICHAEL MOORE
INTERVIEWED BY DAVID HIRNING
The only thing left for working-class hellraiser Michael Moore is radio. Who knows, that could be next. Moore, the creative force behind the ground-breaking documentary Roger and Me and the viciously funny series TV Nation is exactly the sort of character the political left needs to counter the right-wing rantings of Rush Limbaugh and friends. Moore doesn't just despair or get irritated by our declining standard of living, decaying political system, and eroding job security- he gets mad. Fighting mad.
And he gets even, as he did with General Motors when confronted with that company's arrogance, corporate largesse, and community neglect in his hometown of Flint, Michigan, during the Reaganomics of the mid-1980s. Seeking higher profit margins, GM started slashing its workforce and closing plants, eventually laying off 30,000 workers and moving the jobs to Mexico and elsewhere.
Standing in the unemployment line, Moore decided to confront GM Chairman Roger Smith with the company's misdeeds. His quest was the basis for Roger and Me, which despite its low budget and passable production values became the highest-grossing documentary of all-time. But the 42-year-old Moore remains mad as hell. A journalist at heart (he got his start as the editor of an alternative newspaper in Flint), Moore has poured that anger into a new book, Downsize This! Random Threats from an Unarmed American. The book is a blunt, confrontational exposŽ of corporate and government malfeasance. "If Clinton Had Balls...", "Why Are Union Leaders So F&#!ing Stupid?", and "Why Doesn't GM Sell Crack?" are just a few of the funny, biting chapters in which Moore skewers the hypocritical and chronically stupid actions of the Powers that Be.
Moore even takes himself to task for producing the book with non-union researchers. His description of trying to register his staff with a union-any union-is one of the best chapters in Downsize This! Despite his celebrity, Moore remains an average Joe, to the point of putting his America Online address at the back of the book so anyone who wants to can give him feedback. The book was released by Crown Publishers in September, and Moore is scheduled to visit Seattle for a book signing and a benefit reception for the Washington Free Press on October 22 (see announcement this page).
In an interview with the Free Press, Moore discussed his new book, what it's like to produce a politically controversial television show for a major network, what he thinks of the presidential elections, and the job he'd really love to have.
Is this your first book? Why write a book? Is it about getting back to your roots as a journalist?
Yeah, it's my first. I've always been a writer, and I haven't had the chance to do that in a while. As the year started to progress, it looked like we weren't going to get TV Nation on [the air] this year, and I thought, "This is wrong. Here we are in an election year, and we're not on TV." So I went to what I guess was the only outlet available to me, which was just to start writing and try to get a book published.
How would you describe the book? Is it a political book?
Oh yeah, it's politics and humor, from the perspective of someone who grew up in Flint, Michigan.
How's Flint doing these days? Do you think you'll continue to use Flint in your work?
Flint's not doing too well. I hope to continue to work with Flint - I still go back there about a week out of every month [Moore currently lives in New York City]. When I made Roger and Me, what was going on in Flint hadn't happened in a lot of places yet. I thought that it would, which was one of the reasons I was making the film, as sort of a warning that this was coming to your hometown.
Tell me about TV Nation. Is it coming back or not?
It looks like we might be back next year [1997]. Comedy Central will be rerunning all the old episodes beginning in mid-December, but that's about all I know.
It seems to have sort of a tenuous existence - is it because it's too political?
I think with this kind of show you can't expect much more than that. I don't know if it's too political, but it's just a difficult show - it's difficult to work with, makes people nervous.
Do you have run-ins with the Fox [Network] legal department all the time? How is it working with Fox, compared to NBC [the former home of the show]? Is Fox a little more free and loose?
No. We had constant, constant run-ins. Fox was very strict, and went over everthing very closely.
Is TV Nation poking fun at television? Is it a satire for a nation that watches too much TV?
Definitely. I like to think of TV Nation as the anti-TV magazine show, breaking the rules of TV.
Who are you gonna vote for in November?
Richard Jewell. It's the only way to make it up to him. He and his Mom should move into the White House. I trust them more than I trust Clinton at this point.
Is there any hope for alternative politics? What do you think about elections in general - are you a believer in promoting a third party?
My feeling is, before we start talking about a third party we need a second party. We have one political party in this country - the Republicrats, the evil of two lessers, the party of monied interests. And that's why the majority of people, those who are not part of the monied interests, don't vote. One hundred and twenty million people will not vote in this election. I think people have had it.
So what's the answer? I suppose if you knew that...
Right. I think people have to get involved locally. I think it may not be a bad idea for us to take over the Democratic Party, like the Christian Coalition took over the Republican Party. I'd rather move into something already built.
In your book, you're particularly harsh on unions. Recently unions have started a drive for youth. Is labor going in the right direction?
They're doing the right thing. The youth movement and Union Summer is the first step in the right direction, but not all the steps that need to be taken have been. The sort of unquestioning support they're giving Clinton is kind of a wrong-headed move, because Clinton takes them and us for granted. He believes he can sign that welfare bill because we don't have anywhere else to go. One of the central issues of Roger and Me seemed to be the question of, do we have the right to a job, and do corporations owe something to their employees and the communities they exist in?
How do you see that question? Are you pushing for something more based in socialism?
The right to a job should be a priority in this country. Does the corporation owe a person a job? Here's a different way to put it - does the corporation deserve all the tax breaks, grants, services and welfare it receives from us? Maybe they do if they give us jobs. But when Corporate America receives 170 billion dollars of welfare each year and then lays off thousands of workers, that's wrong and should be stopped. I do believe that perhaps the biggest problem that we have in this country is that we have an economic system that is unfair, unjust, and not democratic. Until it is, we're gonna continue to have this kind of disparity, and a lot of people living a very miserable life.
If you weren't a big-shot movie and TV director, what kind of job would you like to be doing?
Subway conductor - I would love to be in charge of these subways!
Michael Moore in Seattle
October 22
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Contents on this page were published in the September/October, 1996 edition of the Washington Free
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